Achievements / Gamerscore. enhances gaming or waste of time?

[ChipTune]

I was wondering whether all this nonsense that keeps popping up every time I play xbox 360 games '15G - first blood', "30G - My First Track' etc etc are a cool way of making you feel like you are making progress and actually accomplishing something, or just a meanless waste of time.

I was a late starter when it came to a 360, only getting round to getting one last year, but have absolutely loved it and it is by far my favourite system of all time due to the XBLA downloadable games, indie games, and online gameplay.. at first I thought the achievements were awesome, a cool way of making you feel like you are really 'beating' the game. But after seeing so many people online with ridiculous gamescore of 200,000 plus, and seeing so many achievements that you get for basically turning the game on, it does make you wonder if it is a good thing for gaming after all. Let me explain..

I think the negative sides of it are that it's really unhealthy for those OCD, completionist, types who inhabit gaming, making them go for every last achievement, even when they are having absolutely no fun doing so. I looked on an achievement site once and on the site I discovered hundreds of people bitching and moaning about how they needed to obtain 100% achievements and couldnt do so as it required too much gameplay or was too hard.. So there are a lot of people out there playing games they don't enjoy, just to get achievement points.. this is very sad.

One in ecco the dolphin on the Megadrive collection made me laugh as it is an achievement you get for eating 200 fish, something you would achieve over the course of a playthrough, yet this angered people as it was 'boring' (to phrase it politely), yet people still did it.. bizarre.

Also achievement points are listed for DLC you havent bought yet, which is a sneaky move by microsoft as the same people above (and they actually do according to the forum posts online) buy the content JUST to get achievement points.

I think a GAME ROOM style high score table, featuring accomplishments like GAME COMPLETED (HARD), or COMPLETED (No CONTINUES), would work better as achievements are basically pointless and your score meaningless due to the fact that :

Completing 100% of SUPER MEAT BOY (nigh on impossible)

gets you the same achievement points as either finishing the first level, killing your first enemy, hacking a terminal, collecting first gold coin etc etc etc for any number of games.. so there is no point to it all.


So I wonder what other people think..? I really enjoy the community aspect of xbox gaming, seeing the best times / high scores of the people in my friends list, as well as world wide, is fantastic.. But Im not so sure on achievement points.. a better system of true hardcore gaming feats would surely be better.


'40G - Reading this thread'

[Negative Creep]

I do find they add value, and I will admit there are certain games I would have given up on if it wasn't for the desire to get a decent number of points from them. What really winds me up however, is how achievements for DLC are added regardless of if you actually have it. Doubtless it's a deliberate ploy to encourage people to download it

[Grizzly]

In some cases achievement points are a great game lengthener particularly for the retro rereleases as it gives you something new to shoot for. A fact I enjoyed with sonic 2, a game that I have played to death already it gave me the excuse to go back and go through it again.

The points can get very tedious at times though, and don't reward accomplishments in the slightest. An example would be 50 cent:blood on the sand (shut up it was fun) you get a 0 point acheivement for dying.

[Megamixer]

I'm not a fan really. I'm glad that some people enjoy them though and they are easily ignored by those of us that don't give a toss so I think in general there aren't any complaints as such.

The only thing that used to annoy me was that PS3 trophy notifications would pop up and the game would slow down for a few seconds. Haven't seen this side effect for a while though so perhaps it was fixed with one of the firmware updates.

Also, I don't get the culture of buying crappy kids games just to max out the achievements and make your trophy/achievement list look better. It's just a load of online willy-waving and if people actually look at what games you'd maxed out to get some of the trophies/achievements then it would be nothing to proud of. A waste of time when these people could be playing games they actually want to play.

There was even an article in OPM once detailing which games to buy purely for easy trophies. I read it and thought "WTF? People actually do this?". Why? Cannot see what's so great about having an 'impressive' online profile built up by hours of crappy games that you'd otherwise never touch with a bargepole.

[Antiriad2097]

Gamerscore is utterly worthless.

Achievements on the other hand can add play value to a game if handled properly.

Doling out achievements for getting to the end of a level is fairly pointless. Making achievements that force you to reconsider your playing style and do things differently can add something. e.g. Quantum of Solace will let you run through a level killing everyone, and you'll get certain achievements from that. Play it by stealth and you'll get different achievements, so there's a reward for replaying the level in a new way.

[gman72]

I love achievements they add bragging rights to game playing and if done cleverly can encourage you to play games in a different way. I love working towards tough achievements and building up a gamer score, i also love stripping easy games of their 1000 gamer points. You must try and embrace the achievements because they are an added element to any game.
The PS3's trophies are rubbish though, no points just rubbish pictures of coloured trophies. As said above achievements on retro remakes are also very cool.

[dste]

Not for me, would much rather be rewarded with unlocking new content in the game.

I can kind of see why people may like them if they can maybe add a new element to a game but cannot see the point of them when they pop-up on the screen and 'reward' you just for starting the game. Also cannot see the point of people playing games just to get the achievements, for me personally that's not really enjoying a game.

[Hitman_HalStep]

they can certainly add to games forcing you to play them differently to get the trophy,as an example the infamous games,i always pick the good choices over evil but because of the trophy system i replayed it and made the opposite choices on both games something i wouldn't normally have done.

[ChipTune]

Don't get me wrong I do enjoy getting achievements, and I have found that it has made me replay completed games to get stuff I missed out first time round.. maybe I would do this anyway, but it's probably due to the added bonus of the achievements.. It's just when you see the people you guys mentioned above, the saddos who buy rubbish, easy games just to boost their score, then it kind of takes away the fun of it and makes you wonder what the point is.. It would be excellent if the achievement points were only dished out for super hard tasks, none of this 30G for finishing the 1st level nonsense..

It is each to their own after all, but it spoils it for me personally seeing people online with 200,000+ score made up up every game they can get their hands on when I am only on 18,000 .. and I play a heck of a lot of indie games on xbox which have no achievements, so the whole score thing in the grand scheme of things is a total waste of time..

[Antiriad2097]

So what you're really saying is that you somehow feel bad because you're not part of the saddo bunch?

Why do you care what other people's gamerscores are? It's a meaningless number that has no relation to game quality, player skill or ability, only volume of games played.

Just be glad you haven't fallen for the marketing hype and take what you do enjoy from it.

Don't feel obliged to grind through games to 100% them. Whether achievements or gamerscore were there or not, it amounts to the same thing.

[James A]

Ive got about 77,000 score but thats as i play alot of games on my 360. Some games it does add a layer of fun. My problem comes if one of my friends moans about an acheivement and then bets my i can't get it. Theres something about my competative edge that then makes me want to get it.

[The Angry Jock]

Achievements on the other hand can add play value to a game if handled properly.

Doling out achievements for getting to the end of a level is fairly pointless. Making achievements that force you to reconsider your playing style and do things differently can add something. e.g. Quantum of Solace will let you run through a level killing everyone, and you'll get certain achievements from that. Play it by stealth and you'll get different achievements, so there's a reward for replaying the level in a new way.

This.

Some achievements are great, some are sh*t, no big deal. If you don't like them then they don't effect gameplay in anyway, used properly they can change a players approach, I think that's worthwhile.

[ChipTune]

So what you're really saying is that you somehow feel bad because you're not part of the saddo bunch?

Why do you care what other people's gamerscores are? It's a meaningless number that has no relation to game quality, player skill or ability, only volume of games played.

Just be glad you haven't fallen for the marketing hype and take what you do enjoy from it.

Don't feel obliged to grind through games to 100% them. Whether achievements or gamerscore were there or not, it amounts to the same thing.

Its not about not being a part of the saddos.. it is that I feel proud when I accomplish something hard on a game, finishing a tough game, 1CC'ing a shmup, beating Super Meat Boy.. that kind of thing.. and my score has increased loads due to things like this.. but I feel like it doesn't count for anything, or show other gamers my abilities in gaming due to the 100% achievement chasing in duff and easy titles.. thats the best way I can think to explain it really.

The high scores on leaderboards are great though as I can see my scores against the people in my friends list.. Game room also gets this right.. its just a shame the achievements couldnt be more reflective of gaming skill.

[samhain81]

While I love grinding a few hours for that trophie to pop up which says '100% completion' as it feels rewarding, I do find that I actually look at a games trophies now before the game itself, which in conclusion makes me believe that the inclusion of these 'virtual acheievments' this generation has been a mistake, as it can easily play with someones mindframe.

[Megamixer]

Its not about not being a part of the saddos.. it is that I feel proud when I accomplish something hard on a game, finishing a tough game, 1CC'ing a shmup, beating Super Meat Boy.. that kind of thing.. and my score has increased loads due to things like this.. but I feel like it doesn't count for anything, or show other gamers my abilities in gaming due to the 100% achievement chasing in duff and easy titles.. thats the best way I can think to explain it really.

I think I know what you're saying. You complete some really hard games, beat some tough achievement requirements and you feel like you've actually achieved something. On the flipside, the scores of others look far more impressive to an outsider when in fact they have purposely bought crap like Hannah Montana just to spam for achievements. It all boils down to who has the bigger score and not necessarily what the gamer has done to get that score and that defeats the object of the system.

To me, this is the ugly side of achievements and trophies: good-natured competition escalating to an obsession where people don't think twice about investing in some utter dross just to reap easy points from and look better than others online.

Having said that, I can also see the postive sides of trophies/achievements and it's good that gamers can enjoy them however they want to while others can ignore them. I think it would be a different story if they were integrated into games at a deeper level however.